20 Nov

Nayacos – (note same codes on Etsy and on mfg) Also – big tip off is when they only offer it in one size (which some designers only one off’s but that is different) with no offer of custom, but the keep selling the same one item in the same size…

similar – not same color:


26 Responses to “nayacos”

  1. Inspector Yuk November 20, 2010 at 12:14 pm #

    Well….I almost figured that they might have been the HISO company opening up a shop on Etsy, but seeing as they get their stuff from different wholesalers, probably not.

    Those free size dresses usually only come that way, so I don’t find it suspicious that they don’t offer alterations on them. They have enough listings that require custom measurements so as far as it being a clue to reselling, not so much.

    But the catalog pictures from different wholesalers is definitely a tip off. Of course those bad old wholesalers probably stole her pictures and designs and now are undercutting her.

    But I think I finally realized why Etsy doesn’t remove these shops. Oddly enough I got the realization after something an Artfire Admin had said. They are dealing with the same issue, albeit on a small scale right now and while they are a handmade site, they consider vintage and supplies reselling (which technically they are) and kind of lump all reselling together. Their argument is the amount of traffic resellers bring to the site. And I honestly think this is the reason Etsy has so much traffic. In addition, Etsy benefits with listing and final value fees (and let’s face it, resellers do pretty well, better than the average handmade seller) so there is really no upside to Etsy to get rid of them.

    AF doesn’t benefit financially in the same way unless they open a pro shop and still that probably doesn’t equal what Etsy would make on the same seller.

    I’m beginning to think we can call out until the cows come home but resellers are here to stay. Unless they sell electronics or obvious things that don’t fit the categories or TOU. I believe Etsy will announce a way to include these sellers, they’ve already expanded the ‘collective’ definition but I foresee a more formal inclusion in the near future.

    I foresee the same on AF. They already have a ‘Design’ category that is supposed to be for artisans who have designed a product but have it made elsewhere and it’s supposed to be limited to a run of 500. But it is a catchall for those who don’t fit the categories of handmade, vintage or supplies but want to sell on AF.

    Again, I think it all boils down to traffic.

  2. madmomma November 20, 2010 at 1:08 pm #

    I have given up on worrying about the re-sellers, I just copy down the crap and post it in hopes that others will at least become aware of the issue.
    I guess try to educate the “public”.
    I believe you are right about Etsy going to let re-sellers in. This “collective” thing is just the first phase of it. Ever try to get an answer from Etsy on the max # of people allowed in a “collective”?
    Not one person has been able to tell me how many people can make up a collective.

  3. WangFu November 20, 2010 at 2:29 pm #

    Then really in the end, there won’t be much difference between etsy and ebay. Oh except you can sell counterfeit merch on etsy.

  4. The Unknown Etsian November 20, 2010 at 4:23 pm #

    Etsy – “Your place for REPLICA items and used shoes!”

  5. WangFu November 20, 2010 at 5:46 pm #

    Well, I do pretty well with vintage shoes…

  6. Thomas November 21, 2010 at 2:05 am #

    167 | Thomas
    November 20, 2010 at 11:56 pm

    following are what detroit commented about me ahead of my comments about you:

    ” 160 | detroit
    November 19, 2010 at 11:00 am

    Well Thomas, are all Chinese as professional, courteous, and as intelligent as you? If so, your country is in trouble.

    Seems like you have an inferiority complex with respect to the US! lol. You need to take your little bitty 小弟弟, and go cry to your Mum that a US company won’t let you break their rules! Boo hoo”

    Dear every one, Do you know what “小弟弟” means in Chinese Slang? here I translate it into English :”Penis”
    Dear every one, Do you know what “肏你祖宗十八代” means in Chinese? Here I translate it into English: ” Fuck you 18 generations of your family”

    Dear every one, please read this blog from the beginning, Did I commented detroit in a unfriendly way initially before he made the first insulting comment about me?

    168 | Thomas
    November 21, 2010 at 12:14 am

    detroit and etsycallout:

    We are a registered company in China, We have registered business number, office address, contact number even my Chinese name in my website.
    We are responsible for what We say and We do.
    But I have to ask:
    etsycallout, detroit,
    Who are you? what is your identification? what is your true name?
    Who autherized you to use “etsy”‘s name to publish blogs about etsy sellers?
    Who give you rights to accuse etsy sellers?
    Who give you rights to judge etsy sellers with your own “rules”
    furthermore, do you have any certificates of distincting ” true handmade items” from ” fake handmade items” issued by any official or folk institutes in US or in any other countries?

    Esty’s statement do testify that “estycallout” has nothing do with esty company and etsy website, nevertheless, etsy also apologized to us for your harrassment caused to us .

    Etsy closed our store as we requested today, We abide by Etsy’s rules, no matter whether it’s decision is correct or wrong.
    We respected etsy’s decision.

    169 | Thomas
    November 21, 2010 at 12:22 am

    but for you guys,
    detroit and etsycallout,
    I am sure You are illegal!
    If you are legal, why don’t you guys don’t publish your names,identifications? why only use your anonymous web names?

    Why don’t guys make statements on your blog like this:”
    We are XXX and XXX, this is a personal blog, which has nothing to do with etsy website and etsy company, We we publish is our personal comments, We are not liable for liability of infringement of laws and privacy, We are not responsible for any insulting and harrassments to anybody!”

    170 | Thomas
    November 21, 2010 at 12:36 am

    Dear all,
    So, If you etsycallout guys can’t testify you are not illegal.
    You guys not only infringes Etsy’s intellectual property rights by ” use “Etsy” word on your “Etsycallout ” blog, You guys also infringes other sellers’s privacy and rights.
    Besides, Did any customers authorized you guys to make gossips on any sellers? No.

    My conclusion:
    Neither Etsy, nor any official insistitues, nor any customers authrozied you to do this illegal gossip job,
    So, What you guys are doing now is doing evil and committing crimes!
    Did you guys realized it?

    I can bet someday, if you guys publish your identifications, Etsy company, any honest seller sure will sue you guys on US courts and get you guys punlished by US laws to get justice for the Etsy users both sellers and buyers.

    171 | Thomas
    November 21, 2010 at 12:53 am

    Dear all,
    I am wondering why etsycallout guys are so angry about us and other sellers on etsy and make rumours around.
    Here is my answer after considerable thinking and investigation:
    1. these etsycallout guys are the true resellers and sellers of fake handmade items on etsy. I read many of their comments on their blogs, they are also etsy sellers. they are in US.
    So, why they are so afraid of sellers in China and other countries out of China?
    as everyone knows:
    handmade items or vintage items made in China and other developing countries are much cheaper than in US, actually now nowadays,there are very few handmade items and vintage items are made in US, because of very high cost of human labor.

    So these guys purchased many items on Alibaba and Tao and other websites, which are made in China, and then list them on etsy to cheat customers they handmade those items.

    But the true makers of the those items find this way to sell they items on etsy. and flood in to sell their own handmade items.

    So, this becomes the disaster and nighmares of these etsycallout guys, because direct sellers in China and other countries compete direclty with these etsycallout guys, these etsycallout guys will surely be defeated, and lose their business.
    So they find wordpress, this free and anonymous blog to attack the real sellers on etsy. at the same time, in case that they will be caught and prosecuted by laws for their crimes, they hide their names and identifications.

    172 | Thomas
    November 21, 2010 at 1:14 am

    You bitch cheater, criminal, real reseller,
    why you are so angry with me?
    Why you don’t dare to use English to insult me, instead using ” Chinese”?

    Now I found reasons:
    1. You surely are a Chinese American , if you are an American citizen, You probably are one of Stowaways without Ameican ID.
    So you even know the worst slang of cursing in Chinese.

    2. You puchased huge lots of items in Alibaba and Taobao and sell them on etsy, So you are very familar with items on those websites, once a true sellers comes on etsy, you found them and start to blogging , commenting and cursing them.

    3. if you are such a Amerian with your Ancestor in China, I am sure every Chinese will whip you this stupid pig, and every Good Chinese man feel shamed of you.

    4.Besides you, there are some other active etsycallout guys seems to be Chinese origin.

    Why you guys don’t feel shamed what you are doing now?
    Why We can’t call you guys criminals and bitches after you shit guys insulted me, even we initially are very polite to you?

    5. The last words, I give you these guys:

    Get fuck off Etsy and your damned Etsycallout!!!! don’t destroy Chinese’s reputation and etsy’s reputation !!
    otherwise, every honest and brave Chinese and American will fuck you off!!!

  7. Catish November 21, 2010 at 2:43 am #

    Don’t feed trolls, just expose them, that’s all I’m saying. And by troll I don’t mean Etsycallout.

  8. jenjasmine November 21, 2010 at 6:33 am #

    hahaha, I can only laugh! What a stupendous meltdown.

  9. The Unknown Etsian November 21, 2010 at 7:41 am #

    Hey Thomas,

    1.If you are a “company” in China, you are considered a “manufacturer” here. That means that your products are not handmade, they are factory goods. People who sell factory goods on Etsy are called resellers. Thank you for clarifying what you are for us.
    2. I know that you communists do not have what we have here which is called “Freedom of speech”. Its actually guaranteed by our government. That means if what we say is true or mostly true, we can pretty much say what we want, when we want. Unlike a communist regime that must control all the actions and deeds of its own citizens. This means we can critique you as much as we want considering that you have identified yourself as a law reseller who did not play by Etsy’s rules. And Americans are very big on playing by the rules.
    3. You are the one destroying China’s “reputation”. Or maybe you are adding to it. While Chinese people on a one to one basis, seem to be very good people, the country as a whole has a reputation for shortcuts when making items that poison people and animals, shoddy workmanship, copyright theft, intellectual theft etc. If you would like China to succeed, perhaps you should be honorable in your dealings with people and not resell on a handmade site (for a start).
    4. After reading all your fantastic conclusions, I think you would do well to take some classes in logic and ethics because you seem to be lacking in these areas.
    5. We have an old saying here in America. BLOW IT OUT YOUR ASS.

  10. Thomas November 21, 2010 at 8:15 am #

    The Unknown Etsian “This means we can critique you as much as we want”
    Yes, You can critisize us, but some guys are insulting us instead of critisizm. they say ” fuck off”, then Should I say ” bitch on”?

    “the country as a whole has a reputation for shortcuts when making items that poison people and animals, shoddy workmanship, copyright theft, intellectual theft etc”
    in some degree and some cases, it is true, but most Chinese company are good and have good reputation. it is similar in USA,
    there also have many crimes each year in USA. Now some GM cars were recalled in China market.
    On the contrary, some American companies imported Chinese items, They requested the lowest prices, some chinese company can’t survive with too little profit, so, they gave American importer the worst products. I admit it is true.

    “Freedom of speech”. I absolutedly aree with you. We also hate communist regime.
    So, some guys can callout about our company and try to ruin our reputation as a good honest business, We surely can reply and debate and fight back for our reputation based on facts and research. do you agree?

    besides, what I stated are mosted based on facts and research plus reasonable logic.

  11. JK November 21, 2010 at 8:30 am #

    Thomas. You are not helping yourself out here. Give up and go away — it’s the best thing you can do.

  12. WhistlingDixie November 21, 2010 at 9:53 am #

    Either there is culture shock here, or just someone who needs electric shock treatments.
    Find your niche and sell in it. Etsy is obviously not going to be your niche or your bitch.

    Nice to know there are crazy people all over the world. Thomas qualifies as an A #1 nutcase.

  13. jenjasmine November 21, 2010 at 10:27 am #

    Thomas is nothing if not persistent.

    Now I have some insight into the resellers who continually do get booted from etsy, and continually open new shops.

  14. em November 21, 2010 at 10:51 am #

    wow. I’ve never seen someone more in the wrong. Keep trying to defend yourself, Thomas, it’s entertaining.

  15. Maul November 21, 2010 at 11:15 am #

    Uh, can Thomas be arrested for saying he hates a Communist regime if they find out?

  16. Life During Wartime November 21, 2010 at 11:36 am #

    Quoting Thomas:
    “So, why they are so afraid of sellers in China and other countries out of China?
    as everyone knows:
    handmade items or vintage items made in China and other developing countries are much cheaper than in US, actually now nowadays,there are very few handmade items and vintage items are made in US, because of very high cost of human labor.”

    Thomas, you do not understand what ‘vintage’ is. There are MILLIONS of vintage items available for sale right now in the USA. Most were made in the USA to older and higher standards of manufacturing we had in the 1930s, 40s, 50s, and 60s before our citizens developed an acceptance of cheaper inferior goods manufactured in Asia. These things were meant to last for decades…many were designed and manufactured so well they look almost new.

    Thanks for your comments, though. Your words demonstrate that Etsy needs to request that all sellers from China define in an email the words HANDMADE and VINTAGE, giving examples in words and photos, before shops from your country are allowed to open on Etsy.

  17. um_ya November 21, 2010 at 11:56 am #

    Get fuck off Etsy and your damned Etsycallout!!!! don’t destroy Chinese’s reputation and etsy’s reputation !!
    otherwise, every honest and brave Chinese and American will fuck you off!!!
    Thomas, I think you’ve done a pretty good job destroying China’s reputation with your rant and certainly your language. Your reselling (and others like you) on Etsy has also helped destroy its reputation as a handmade marketplace.

  18. Life During Wartime November 21, 2010 at 12:09 pm #

    While I consider Thomas to be very mistaken about how smart he is and how well he understands doing business in America, I don’t think he is typical of business persons in the new China. Savvy Chinese businesses realize that there is a huge global market for their goods, which they can easily sell to thousands of distributors without trying to set up on Etsy IN VIOLATION OF ETSY’S TERMS OF SERVICE.

  19. Inspector Yuk November 21, 2010 at 12:24 pm #

    What is this, “All About Thomas”?

    Get over it Thomas, you are just one of thousands of resellers we call out and try to get removed from Etsy. You are nothing special and it’s not personal.

    We are not ‘afraid’ of you, we just don’t want to have to compete with you in a venue that was meant to be for sole artists and crafters, or small groups of people making things by hand who share in the profits, not a man who employs people to make things.

    I think you are missing the whole point. Etsy was founded because the sole artist or craftsman didn’t really have a venue to sell in without competing with companies like yours. Someone who by themselves think of a design, draw out a pattern, buy material and cut out the dress and then sew it themselves, maybe embellish it with beads or lace by hand, then find someone to model it, take pictures of it, edit those pictures, then upload them on their home computer, edit the photos if they need it, write a description and hope and pray that the materials they bought, the time they spent didn’t go to waste because, naturally, their price has to reflect all that went into it. Not to mention they then have to package it up and ship it out…themselves.

    The whole premise behind Etsy was that the sole artisan or crafter could sell in a place where they didn’t have to compete with people like you who have multiple people doing the cutting, sewing, computer work, shipping and can produce on a higher level and therefore charge less. I’m sure your handmade items (made by many pairs of hands compared to a single or perhaps 2 pair of hands in some cases) are wonderful, well made and you have happy customers. That really has nothing to do with this issue.

    Imagine if it were you, just you doing all the work that your employees do. From designing to cutting fabric, to sewing, to listing and shipping. Maybe you have an assistant who can do the computer and take care of shipping to help you out. Now, imagine you found a place to sell your handmade, by you, items where everyone else was in the same situation, one or two people doing everything. How would you feel if factories like yourself started to open shops on that site? How would you feel if they were claiming to be handmade, and because of the definition of the word technically your items are handmade, but not in the spirit or rules of the site?

    No one thinks you’re evil or that your stuff is crap, they just feel that you don’t belong on Etsy. the fact that more and more factory produced products are showing up on Etsy is a cause of severe frustration and angst from sellers who believe Etsy should stick to their original vision.

    I am really glad to hear that your company makes quality products and you care about your customers. There are a lot of mass manufacturers who produce cheap crap, and I’m sure you know it. Unfortunately, Etsy isn’t the venue for your products, though I have to say for myself, I’d rather have your factory than some of the other reseller crap people on Etsy try to pass off as Vintage or Handmade. At least there is a ‘person’ behind your shop.

  20. em November 21, 2010 at 1:04 pm #

    I think in addition to the definition of vintage, you don’t know Etsy’s definition of handmade. On Etsy, handmade equals HANDMADE BY YOU. You = yourself, not a dozen or so other employees whose hands touch the product.

  21. Lisa November 21, 2010 at 1:25 pm #

    Don’t try to reason with an unreasonable person. You’ll be disappointed every time…

  22. Life During Wartime November 21, 2010 at 1:46 pm #

    em, you’re right. Which is why Etsy should have from the very beginning made it a firm policy to (politely, with help of professional translators if necessary) question each and every shop located in the manufacturing sector of the Pacific Rim about the seller’s understanding of the meanings of ‘handmade’ and ‘vintage’ according to the Etsy TOU.

    Because without establishing that Etsy and the seller are on the same page from day one, shop closings can appear to be based on prejudice rather than TOU violation by the selller.

  23. madmomma November 21, 2010 at 2:00 pm #

    I couldn’t follow any of his rant – too confusing!
    and then I decided perhaps that is for the best…

    so weird he even thought this was associated with Etsy in ANY way… why didn’t he go argue with people in the Etsy forums?

    Hey Thomas, you need to log on to the real ETSY site and complain there, I bet a LOT of people would be more than happy to listen to you in the forums there!

  24. PussDaddy November 21, 2010 at 4:38 pm #

    Their name reminds me of nachos. But nachos are good. And I would rather have nachos than this crap.


  25. already gone November 22, 2010 at 4:40 am #

    I said once before, a long time ago, that I don’t think I’d mind if etsy allowed re-sellers as long as they had their own category, or even a separate space. Kind of like how Eddie Bauers website takes you to a different site for their clearance items. However, while reading through this post another problem with the Chinese market occurred to me. And this is the reason no one should buy Chinese factory crap! Thomas, (or whatever his name is), probably works a regular, (by our standards), day, drives home in his nice car to his lovely home, eats good food, wears good clothes, has children in school, and a wife who is a “lady who lunches”. His employees are probably all young girls between the ages of 12-20 who live with their big families in shanty towns, work excessively long days for $2 a day. If one of them makes a mistake he can dock their pay for a month, therefore he has free “slave” labor for a while. or beat them and then dock their pay. There are no happy employees, especially of the female persuasion. So I’ve changed my opinion! If American manufacturing companies wish to set up shop on etsy, in their own special category than fine. Third world countries who thrive on cheap, slave, and child labor need not apply!

  26. Scrapmetal November 24, 2010 at 12:30 pm #

    Thomas, NO ONE is against you and your business. More power to you for being an entrepreneur and business owner, especially if you are in the People’s republic of China (not sure) with its anti-capitalist philosophy!! However, Etsy is NOT the place for your business. There are many other selling venues for you to go on that are not handmade based. I suggest you take some time to find the best selling places for you that do not include handmade sites. There is no point to the invective that is spilling on this blog (and that applies to everyone BTW)

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